Connections: AgustÃn Fuentes and the
Story of Free Market Capitalism
Discussions about economic
issues in the United States suffer from two debilitating limitations, neither
of which shows signs of abating any time soon.
First, and perhaps most
evidently, increasing social and political polarization has meant that such conversations
too often descend into a cacophony of competing claims; a fundamental unwillingness
to even listen to opposing points of view dooms them from the outset as participants
stridently argue for and defend their particular position as being the only reasonable
one. The situation is captured brilliantly,
if unintentionally, by a front page headline in the New York Times from June
16, 2019: Lost in
Abortion Noise: Nuance, a headline applicable for most any fill-in-the-blank
topic at this fraught moment.
A second, more subtle
limitation – present even when people do manage to engage in a sober conversation
about our economic future – arises out of the unwritten rules about what can reasonably
be discussed, a concept referred to for politicians as the Overton window: “the range of policies politically acceptable to the mainstream population at a given time.” Discussions about
economic policy are constrained to an extremely narrow Overton window: falling
within it are considerations over whether and how to regulate capitalism; on
the other hand, considering alternatives to capitalism lies decidedly beyond its
edges.
The implications of this second
limitation, and the ways in which the mainstream both subtly and overtly enforce
what is considered acceptable, were highlighted recently in an interview by Krista
Tippett for her program On Being.
Although I’m a big fan and
occasional supporter of On Being, and I find Tippett’s interviews
deeply engaging and enlightening, I’ll admit upfront that in what follows I’m
going to be rather unfair to her. Tippett
generously provides listeners podcasts of her unedited interviews with guests –
the hour and half or so of raw material that goes into the final, officially released,
hour-long program – and I’m going to take advantage of her generosity here by quoting
directly from one of these unedited releases.
The interview in question
was a fascinating discussion with biological and evolutionary anthropologist
AgustÃn Fuentes, entitled
This Species Moment, (the final
program is linked to at right, along with the transcript of the final
version, and the unedited interview).
In
what follows here, the portions quoted in normal font are from the official transcript,
while the parts quoted in italics are my transcription from the unedited interview.
In the final, released show,
Tippett introduces her interview with Fuentes by noting: “We’re exploring his
spacious perspective on human nature, and capacities his intelligence for working
with the insights 2020 has laid bare.” She
goes on to highlight in particular their discussion on “modern economic theory …
[and] the extreme inequity in wealth distribution across the planet in the early
21st century.”
She opens this exchange on
the economy by noting:
We touched on COVID-19, the
virus, and this is also part of the human niche as you describe it. Then
there’s the incredible economic fallout of the response to this virus. And it’s
also a moment — this moment was upon us, but it’s even more upon us now, and I
think this will deepen as we move into the next year — that there’s something
profoundly out of whack in the way we do an economy.
Notably, however, most of the
next several minutes of their exchange (around the 36’ mark of the unedited interview)
don’t make the final, released version of the show. Certainly, in going from an 80-minute interview
to a 50-minute final show (which also includes musical interludes), the conversation will be smoothed out to remove the hesitations and false starts of typical conversations, and some whole segments will necessarily be left out.
But in these excised portions, both in the comments themselves and in how
they are expressed, it feels like Tippett carefully avoids stepping outside what
she perceives to be the Overton window for the majority of her audience with
respect to discussions on our economic system.
In particular, she avoids directly
suggesting that capitalism or the free
market are implicated in the economic issues she highlights, and in
so doing struggles to find a way to express her concerns.
The … the … the … I don’t
know where to … you know, the … I’m mean … one thing that I’m so aware of is
how the market … if we ever believed that it was some kind of reflection of
overall economic well-being or was connected to the economic lives of actual people,
that’s just clearly not true. And, the
economic disparity, which, whatever your philosophy of that is … such a small,
small number, just literal number of human beings, control so much of the wealth
of the global economy.
She seems clearly to be seeking
a way to point at the economic issues she wants to discuss with Fuentes without
actually saying “capitalism,” without calling into question the fundamental
system. Even when she mentions “the
market,” she hesitates a moment, before plunging forward with her statement.
Fuentes, however, crashes through
the boundaries of this Overton window on economics for her, linking capitalism
and the market economy directly to the current suffering of so many. This, effectively, gives Tippett permission to
follow him through to broader considerations, which she promptly does, and the
two then proceed into a concrete discussion of the current economic situation.
Fuentes: We created the contemporary
economy, and we are suffering for it. There’s
no doubt about it. I think the way you
describe this is this idea that right now if you think about it, 0.7 percent of
the globe’s population control nearly half of the wealth; that’s not right, I
don’t know of any context in which that’s right.
So, if this economic system,
this sort of current capitalist market global economy that is sort of not the
only but essentially the dominant in the world, if this only benefits a teeny
percentage of humanity really, that doesn’t sound very good. Humans usually don’t do things on average that
are highly deleterious for the vast majority of any given community.
Tippet: Right!
Later in their discussion, it
is Fuentes who circles back to observe the challenges associated with questioning
capitalism and the free market; having stepped outside the Overton window, he
looks back at it to emphasize the need to initiate among the general population
a broader conversation about how our economics systems could and should function. Not surprisingly, along the way he feels the
need to defend himself against the criticism always quick to be mounted against
anyone questioning capitalism as the one, true economic system.
Fuentes: Absolutely, but it’s
systemic processes, and the problem is, everyone talks about individuals. Economies are not about individuals, they are
about societies, the processes. And so,
in fact, I think if we could push a little bit, and educate folks, or have
folks think more deeply about, What is it we’re doing?
And I’m not arguing against
our contemporary systems writ larger; I’m not saying get rid of our economy,
but we can – there’s always going to be inequality – but we can manage how that
inequality is shaped, how extensive it is, and how it works. We know that, economists know that, it’s unavoidable,
if you understand how these systems work.
And yet, so many people are much more, sort of, structured in their
belief systems to go buy a lottery ticket, than they are to vote, or to really
think about how one would change the given system, and the power of the belief
of human nature, this idea, the idea that this contemporary market system is free
and open and the cream rises to the top. It’s simply not true.
Tippett then hints at the bludgeon
that critics so often used to silence questioning of capitalism, a rhetorical weapon
invented by the economic winners, who have craftily convinced the economic losers
to wield for them – and Fuentes again takes her lead to make it explicit:
Tippett: Right. And this is such an … this discussion is
alive in our society, and I’m a bit older than you, and it’s a fascinating
thing to me that it’s alive, I mean, the cold war kind of shut down any question
about capitalism.
Fuentes: I think something
that’s really important to point out is that everyone says, “Well, communism
failed.” Yes. Soviet communism failed miserably. That doesn’t mean that American
capitalism is working wonderfully. Those two things are actually not even
related.
Tippett: Right. Again, it’s
a false binary.
Fuentes: So let’s get rid of
that binary, and let’s ask ourselves, how does our economy work? Are people
getting paid the level, the value of the quality of their work? Is there equal
access to different things? These questions, as you said, have been going on —
for example, in the United States over the last century, there’s been this
incredible dynamic of thinking about these kinds of economic processes. But now
I think you’re right, I think people are saying, wait a minute. How did we get
here? And the thing is, we know how
we got here, and we know how to change it.
Tippett: Something I
also appreciate, that you point out, and really, first of all, that it’s
possible to have this conversation and take it out of that fight, about
capitalism versus communism.
Here, then, the fundamental plea:
unburden discussions and considerations of our economic future from the simplistic
accusation so often used to shut them down – that questioning capitalism
necessarily implies advocating Soviet-style communism as the alternative. And, thus freed, enter into a constructive
conversation about what a sustainable economic future could look like.
During their conversation on
economic issues and how to begin addressing them, Tippett and Fuentes touch on
a number of themes that point to holes in the dogma built up to defend the
existing economic system, and that have been getting increasing attention from
scholars from a variety of fields.
The pair note, for example, a
simple yet powerful realization about our economic system:
Tippet: One of the things
you’ve pointed out is that our economy reflects our view of human nature, our
beliefs about human nature. And so, this
is a mirror of … it’s such a tangible reality, and yet it is an invention, it
is an act of the imagination.
Fuentes: We created the contemporary
economy, and we are suffering for it.
That is, the economic system
we have today did not evolve naturally but rather was constructed. To use the language of historian Yuval Noah
Harari in his book Sapiens (my review linked to at right),
it is one of many stories that humans created and tell
themselves:
There are no gods in the
universe, no nations, no money, no human rights, no laws, and no justice
outside the common imagination of human beings.
Harari expanded on this idea
and its implications, in a 2017 interview with Sam Harris on the Making
Sense podcast entitled Reality and
the Imagination (at 27’ 55’’), in language that aligns with Fuentes’
comment above that we are “suffering” as a result of one such story, that of our
economic system.
My understanding is that a
source of human power, but also the source of much human misery is … the human
imagination, and the ability of humans to create fictional stories, and then to
believe them, to such an extent that they can start entire wars just because
they believe some religious or national or economic fiction. ... We control
this planet not because as individuals we are much more intelligent than
chimpanzees or pigs or dogs, but rather because we are the only mammal that can
cooperate in very large numbers; and we
can do that because we believe in fictions. If we examine any large-scale human
cooperation, you always find a fictional story at the basis, whether it’s about
god, or the nation, or money, or even human rights. Human rights, like god in
heaven, they are just a story invented by humans, they are not a biological reality.
And critically, Tippett and
Fuentes go on to note that the creation of our economic system, this story we
tell ourselves, actually originated out of false understandings about human
nature. Their discussion of this begins with
a consideration of why humans don’t behave as rational economic
actors – as individuals focused on maximizing their personal benefit from
the economy – and then transitions to comment on the fundamental origins of
these assumption of rational economic behavior.
Tippett: Something that you
point at that I really appreciate is that why we don’t behave as rational
economic actors — because you are about understanding why and how we actually
do things — is not because we’re stupid, but because we’re social.
Fuentes: Exactly.
Tippett: There’s this sentence
from your writing that — I had to think hard about it. But you said, “We willingly
accept losses as often as gains, in exchanges. The reason is that for the
majority of humans” — because classic economic theory would say that we would
have an intolerance for loss. But you said, “For the majority of humans, exchanges
are not about profit, but about making and keeping social connections.”
Fuentes: Exactly. These exchanges,
these back-and-forth — this is about our sociality. It’s not about the money.
There are many exchanges that are about money, but really, humans are constantly
— we do things all the time for people, which if we did the cost-benefit
analysis, we’d end up losing, but we do them because we end up winning. They’re
part of this whole social dynamic that we’ve been talking about.
And I think if we
understand that, then we come back to this notion that what’s really central
for humanity are our acts of compassion and caring. And that gets us back to this
idea of hope. There’s always hope for humanity, and there’s capacity, if we think
about our exchanges not just as economic relationships, but as the patterns and
processes of building the human society, we’re gonna think about it in a very
different way.
These last thoughts from Fuentes,
that “what’s really central for humanity are our acts of compassion and caring,”
resonate strongly with the thesis of historian Rutger Bregman in his book Humankind:
A Hopeful History. Bregman argues
that our deep-seated belief that competition and greed are fundamental and even
necessary characteristics of human nature – that absent a thin veneer of
civilization, people’s true, selfish nature would emerge – is not only wrong,
but worse it undermines our ability to progress further on our project of
civilization. Using a fresh analysis of human history, he rebuts the
presumption that humans are inherently selfish, a belief that he notes has been
largely unchallenged doctrine for millennia.
And, just as Tippett brings
up with Fuentes that “one of the things you’ve pointed out is that our
economy reflects our view of human nature, our beliefs about human nature,”
so Bregman argues that it was during the Enlightenment that these cynical ideas
about human nature became institutionalized. Enlightenment period philosophers
and politicians celebrated it, building institutions based on reason and
rationality that aimed to encourage and support each individual’s (apparently
inherent) selfish behavior as a path to furthering the greater good. Thus were
born: economic systems that encouraged people to focus on a desire to make a
profit; democratic systems such as the U.S. constitution that created “a system
of ‘checks and balances’, in which everybody kept an eye on everybody else;" and more generally a rule of law “governed by reason alone.”
Certainly, acknowledges
Bregman, “a few centuries into the Age of Reason [a]ll things considered, … the
Enlightenment has been a triumph for humankind … our lives … exponentially better
and the world … richer, safer and healthier than ever before.” But he then, in perhaps the most trenchant
statement in his engaging and convincingly argued work, fires a direct shot
across the bow of the cruise ship filled with end of history celebrants, saying
of these Enlightenment approaches to our world: “it was the best answer – until
now.”
For, willing to grant the
Enlightenment institutions their due in lifting the world over the past several
centuries out of the abject poverty and misery that was the inheritance of the
shift to an agricultural society, he proposes that these institutions are not
the final, best approach. He argues that it has come time to consider the next
step in our social evolution, pointing out that:
the Enlightenment also had
a dark side. Over the past few centuries we’ve learned that capitalism can run
amok, sociopaths can seize power and a society dominated by rules and protocols
has little regard for the individual.
The flaw of Enlightenment
thinking and the institutions that arose from it, according to Bregman, is in
fact precisely the mistaken assumption that selfishness is fundamental to human
nature. (My review of Bregman’s book linked to at right.)
And Fuentes expresses
Bregman’s idea of this selfish image of human nature as being a learned concept
in an exchange later in his discussion with Tippett:
Tippett: And this, the perspective
that you bring, is an interesting and, I think, a refreshing way to look at it,
because the discussion that gets had becomes very partisan, and actually quite
emotional. But just to point out, as you do, that we have this system that actually
is based on an idea about how human beings behave, that is simply not true –“
Fuentes: Yes.
Tippett: that this kind of economy is based on an idea
that we are essentially rational, logical economic creatures, and to the extent
that we’re not, we’ll balance each other out, and you pointed out this study
that I hadn’t heard about, in the 1990’s, this study in twelve countries, four continents,
and there was not a single society in which people consistently behave in
accordance with expectations of basic economic theory.
Fuentes: And that’s because,
to behave in expectation … to behave as a good capitalist, you have to grow up
in a capitalist society, that’s the way it works; if you grow up in a different
kind of society, then your values, your perceptions, the way in which you think
about money, for example, are totally different. And so, if we created it, right,
we can alter it. And that’s my point.
Thus, Fuentes argues, we are
trained (as Bregman also claims) to believe that humans are fundamentally selfish,
and, as a consequence, that free market capitalism is therefore the best
possible economic system, and so finally raised to be good capitalists who actively
defend the system against any evidence to the contrary. As Fuentes points out earlier in the interview:
you’ve got to ask yourself,
where did we get this and what’s going on, and that’s the really interesting question,
because so many people who are even harmed by the contemporary economic system,
they’ll support it, because they believe wholly and fully that this is the outcome
of human nature, that this is the outcome of naturalness.
Another aspect that Fuentes
explores of the economic story that has been created, is a more recent addition
to the narrative we have been raised – particularly in the West – to believe:
Fuentes: that those who have money
have money because of reasons of their genetic endowment or some kind of incredible
business neuro-biological savvy…”
Tippett: It is kind of ‘survival
of the fittest’ …
Fuentes: Yes!
Tippett: A very simple
equation.
Fuentes: And it’s just not
true, right? People who have money aren’t
necessarily – some could be quite smart – [but] many of them inherit money; the
vast majority of people who have a lot of money have always had it.
Tippett: Or, they’re smart
at some very specific little thing …
Fuentes: Right
Tippett: Not necessarily
wiser, or smarter on balance.
Here, Fuentes draws similar
conclusions to those of economist Thomas Piketty in his engaging and thought-provoking
book
Capital in the Twenty-First Century (my review at right).
Piketty presents extensive data that demonstrate
Fuentes’ point about the significant impact of inheritance, and its powerful tendency
in the capitalist system to cause wealth to become more concentrated among an
elite few under quite naturally occurring economic conditions.
But, more directly to Fuentes’ specific point,
Piketty also calls out the illusion of meritocracy that those who most benefit
from the economic system as it exists today have propagated among the rest of
society, in order to maintain their own right to further enrich themselves:
The conventional wisdom
that modern economic growth is a marvelous instrument for revealing individual
talents and aptitudes … has all too often been used to justify inequalities of
all sorts, no matter how great their magnitude and no matter what their real
causes may be, while at the same time gracing the winners in the new industrial
economy with every imaginable virtue.
Later, focusing more specifically
on the enormous and still growing disparity in wage income, particularly in the
United States, Piketty writes:
a very high level of total income inequality [which] can
be the result of a ‘hypermeritocratic society’ (or at any rate a society that
the people at the top like to describe as hypermeritocratic) … a very
inegalitarian society, but one in which the peak of the income hierarchy is dominated
by very high incomes from labor rather than by inherited wealth …. It is hardly
surprising that the winners in such a society would wish to describe the social
hierarchy in this way, and sometimes they succeed in convincing some of the
losers.
For many years there have been
attempts to reform capitalism by pointing out its negative impacts, such as dramatically
rising inequality and ignored environmental externalities, which, despite the
benefits capitalism has brought about historically, now lead to concerns about
its future sustainability. These approaches
at reform have mostly failed to gain traction, in large part because of the kind
of aura that has built up around capitalism as the inevitable, ultimate outcome
of human economic development. This
end-of-history belief has become so strong that even the losers in the economic status quo defend the system, easily persuaded that other reasons
lie behind their economic struggles, typically some other they who are to blame: another race, immigrants, foreign governments, to name a few.
In the past few years, however,
a new front has been opened in the pursuit of economic reform, one focused on
pointing out that free market capitalism is not necessarily
the final stage in the evolution of economic systems, but rather an artificial construct
built on potentially incorrect assumptions about human nature. And, if the story we have been telling
ourselves is no longer working, then perhaps it is high time to write ourselves
a new one.
Other notes and information:
Have you read this book, others by this author, or even similar
ones by other authors? I’d enjoy hearing your thoughts.
Other of my book reviews: FICTION Bookshelf and NON-FICTION Bookshelf